Less than smooth vehicle movements

[220hotwheels]

Hi everyone

I don't know if this applies just to my layouts but I have always found that vehicle movements, can at times be a little "jittery". I initially thought that this might be caused as the vehicle, could be car, van, truck, bus or train, passing over a track connection or a track contact but the more I study this phanomina the more I have come to realise that this is not the case.

I have checked my graphics settings and they appear to be as they should be. When I look at the fps they too seem to be OK, between 42 and 60fps. My graphics card is a Nvidia Geforce 4070 with 12Gb, an i7 13th generation processor and 32GB of RAM so I don't think the problem is with the equipment.

I have turned off special effects in the programs graphic settings, put anti-aliasing to high but still no improvement. My conclusion therefore is that perhaps the problem lies with my EM, but thats just a last guess.

If anyone can enlighten me further on this anomally then I would be most grateful.

Puzzled Pete

 

[Goetz]

vor 4 Minuten schrieb 220hotwheels:

If anyone can enlighten me further on this anomally

Do you use depots? The ejection of a vehicle from a depot may cause the studio to freeze momentarily.
This may be more significant early after loading your layout, because the cars and trains in your depots are known only by name (read: ID) until their first release. 

 

[220hotwheels]

1 hour ago, Goetz said:

Do you use depots? The ejection of a vehicle from a depot may cause the studio to freeze momentarily.
This may be more significant early after loading your layout, because the cars and trains in your depots are known only by name (read: ID) until their first release. 

 

Hi Goetz

I trust you are well. To answer your question, yes I am using depots. Whilst I can understand your conclusion I have to say that I have noticed this anomaly even after I have been using the program for several hours. Since posting this enquiry I have gone into the Nvidia control panel and added 3D Modellbahn to the list of approved programs. It does appear to have made a difference but I will have to monitor it all for several hours just to make sure it's not just my imagination. 

So fingers crossed, unless someone else comes up with a more complete solution.

Best regards

Pete

[Phrontistes]

Hi Pete @220hotwheels,

vor 2 Stunden schrieb 220hotwheels:

I have always found that vehicle movements, can at times be a little "jittery".

Because of this behavior I removed most of the depots. Since then the picture ist smooth.

vor 1 Stunde schrieb 220hotwheels:

I have noticed this anomaly even after I have been using the program for several hours.

Me too while using depots. This doesn't change as time goes on.

Kind regards

Phrontistes

[220hotwheels]

4 minutes ago, Phrontistes said:

Hi Pete 220hotwheels,

Because of this behavior I removed most of the depots. Since then the picture ist smooth.

Me too while using depots. This doesn't change as time goes on.

Kind regards

Phrontistes

Hi Phrontistes

Thanks for your comment. It would seem that you and Goetz have the same conclusion. As you have probably noticed I have added 3D modellbahn to my list of approved users in my Nvidia control panel and whilst I have only run the program for 1 hour since doing so, it does appear to be much improved. I'll test it for longer tomorrow but if the only solution is to ditch the V. Depots then I would judge that the problem is with the program!!!

It will be interesting to get Neo's input.

Best regards

Pete

[prinz]

Hallo @220hotwheels,

the Problem with depots knows neo. See 

We all hope that neo will find a solution.

[220hotwheels]

Hi Prinz

Many thanks for your comment. At least if Neo is aware of this problem them hopefully in time it will be fixed. In the meantime as you have probably noted I do seem to have found a possible intrim solution. Whilst I only ran the program yesterday afternoon for one hour I did notice a difference. Before, when planes were taking off, they would judder at least twice as they ran along the runway. After my possible fix they did not judder at all. Now this may just be a fluke but a much longer test during today with more than just the planes will give me a greater insight. I'll let everyone know if the inprovement is universal and applies to all moving items. I currently have over 20 V. depots so remodelling to remove them would be quite a feat. Fingers crossed it won't be necessary.

Best regards

Pete

[220hotwheels]

Hi @Goetz, @prinz, @Phrontistes

Hi Guys

As promised here are my conclusions.

Whilst my solution to add the program to my Nvidia control panel of approved programs made a significant difference it did not solve the problem entirely. I don't know sufficient about the Nvidia settings to be able to play around with them and so have left well alone.  I have therefore reduced the number of V.depot down to 5, re:evaluated the hidden holding area, which in doing so has increased the program size from 4645kb to 4820kb, not great as it probably means that the finished layout is going to be around 5500kb but it has provided a much smoother conclusion for all moving objects. The animated people now walk with a confident step rather than the occasions hop and skip!!!

So if any other members have thoughts that will improve the situation further then, as the saying goes, "I'm all ears".

Best reghards

Pete

[Phrontistes]

Hi Pete @220hotwheels,

the depots are a nice thing as storage but cannot be used in permanent operation. Not only because of the phenomenon you observed, but also because you can't get to the vehicle variables and because Neo releases all groups in which a vehicle that is stored in the depot is involved. Use portals and fiddle yards instead of depots.

Kind regards

Phrontistes

[220hotwheels]

41 minutes ago, Phrontistes said:

Hi Pete 220hotwheels,

the depots are a nice thing as storage but cannot be used in permanent operation. Not only because of the phenomenon you observed, but also because you can't get to the vehicle variables and because Neo releases all groups in which a vehicle that is stored in the depot is involved. Use portals and fiddle yards instead of depots.

Kind regards

Phrontistes

Thanks Phrontistes, I've done that in part leaving just 3 V.depots to combine 2 seperate elements. Clearly I will have to try to rethink these so that I can get rid of these 3 depots, just leaving the 2 for the planes to disappear and then reappear.

Best regards

Pete

[Eggu]

Are there some other known causes which yields to the freeze effect ?

I watch the freeze effect every 9 secs in one construction, but sometimes more randomly in other or modified constructions.
Tryed to change graphic settings from 40 fps up to 100, from low to high quality, but nearly the same effect.

No depots, some portals, but effect is not synchronized with any animation or passing a portal.

Somehow annoying when watching a mostly smooth train ride.

Regards,
Eggu
 

[220hotwheels]

2 hours ago, Eggu said:

Are there some other known causes which yields to the freeze effect ?

I watch the freeze effect every 9 secs in one construction, but sometimes more randomly in other or modified constructions.
Tryed to change graphic settings from 40 fps up to 100, from low to high quality, but nearly the same effect.

No depots, some portals, but effect is not synchronized with any animation or passing a portal.

Somehow annoying when watching a mostly smooth train ride.

Regards,
Eggu
 

Hi Eggu

My knowledge of graphics settings is pretty limited but I have always assumed that 60fps was about the right maximum. My current layout is, at present 4803kb, so quite involved but after reducing the number of V. Depot's to just 5, 2 for the aircraft and 3 for all the trains, with a completely revised fiddle yard together with the revised graphics settings as per the screenshots I have to say that all seems to be running as smooth as silk, well at any rate it has for the last couple of days so long may it continue. I've also attached a few screensjots of some arears of this layout just to show how involved some of it is. The wood mill for example has logs being loaded onto AGV's taken into the milling shed and then they come back out with the finished timber. Trucks come and go loading finished timber, staff move around checking on various elements. The diggers move wood shavings away from the mills to a holding area where they are loaded onto tipper trucks to be whisked away.

The airport is a hive of activity with luggage tugs, catering vans and fuel trucks all buzzing about servicing the various planes. I've still got plenty to do in order to complete this layout and expect it to finish well over 5000kb, All of that said I find the fps usuall runs between 45 and 60fps depending upon the amount of detail I have on screen so as long as movement remains nice and smooth then I will be a very happy bunny!!

Best regards

Pete

[Eggu]

Hi Pete,

thank you for the detailed description, great construction as can be seen at your pictures.

I think it is not a problem with fps, there is no frame drop,
I assume some other special design element which causes the freeze effect, but I can't figure out.
Or might be some special hardware conflict or setting.

Regards,
Eggu

[220hotwheels]

20 minutes ago, Eggu said:

Hi Pete,

thank you for the detailed description, great construction as can be seen at your pictures.

I think it is not a problem with fps, there is no frame drop,
I assume some other special design element which causes the freeze effect, but I can't figure out.
Or might be some special hardware conflict or setting.

Regards,
Eggu

OK, well best of luck sorting that one out. I realise my computer spec is quite good. When I try to work on my laptop none of my larger layouts run so smoothly, I can only assume that as the i7 processor is 8th generation and the graphics card and ram are not so good that this is the problem, but fortunately I don't often need to use my laptop for this program. Just a thought but have you checked your task manager, device manager to see which graphics card the program is using. Most PC's have 2 graphics cards and I had to manually tell 3D Train Studio to use the Nvidia one rather than the UHD graphics, that did make quite a difference.

Best of luck

Pete

[Eggu]

I also had to choose my Nvidia card for this program in the nvidia-manager-settings.

Because I am some month out of home abroad,
I bought a gaming notebook for gaming and train-ing () with a lot of graphic power:
Prozessor    AMD Ryzen 9 7945HX with Radeon Graphics  2.50 GHz, RAM    32,0 GB 
NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4080 Laptop GPU (12 GB GDDR6 RAM)

If this is not sufficient to have a smooth system without any jitter, I will look for an other less expensive hobby. 

Best regards,
Eggu

[220hotwheels]

14 hours ago, Eggu said:

I also had to choose my Nvidia card for this program in the nvidia-manager-settings.

Because I am some month out of home abroad,
I bought a gaming notebook for gaming and train-ing () with a lot of graphic power:
Prozessor    AMD Ryzen 9 7945HX with Radeon Graphics  2.50 GHz, RAM    32,0 GB 
NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4080 Laptop GPU (12 GB GDDR6 RAM)

If this is not sufficient to have a smooth system without any jitter, I will look for an other less expensive hobby. 

Best regards,
Eggu

Hi Eggu

That is a really nice spec you have there and I cannot see why you would continue to have such problems with "freezing" everything should work perfectly. Clearly there must be another issue, possibly with your EV. As a last resort perhaps it might be worth seeking help from Neo.

I'll be keen to hear what the issue is once you manage to solve it.

Best regards

Pete